Not really. I was 12, so they didn't go into much detail.

So I'm more confident in my upper extremity measurements. I'll start with shoulder flexion. She had 15 degrees on the left and 30 degrees on the right.

The fat one.

Correct, because I'm creating the rotation. That rotation allows me to be very selective. So I can put your left foot on the ground in a split squat and I can create an overcoming action, or I could turn the sacrum and create the yielding action. So that's not one or the other—it's how I am coaching and positioning people as they're moving through this glute stance orientation. So I can turn the sacrum away from the front leg and maintain that late propulsive strategy on the lead leg, or I can turn the sacrum into the lead leg. So when we were talking about the offset weight: if I have a left leg forward split squat and I put the weight in the right hand, that's going to help me capture the early propulsive strategy on that left side because the offset weight is going to turn the sacrum towards the lead leg. If I put the same side as the lead leg, it turns me away and now I create the overcoming action.

My second objective would be to discuss compression and expansion and the effects on mobility. I would like to start with something very simple, such as just like the bicep and the tricep compression expansion. Then I would like to go to a model where I have a rib cage from a transverse view that is cut in four sections, and show compression and expansion along anterior and posterior and show them how that could cause rotations and changes in orientation. From there, I would discuss the primary compensations and the archetypes. I would describe how the very wide archetype will tend to have more compression along the posterior aspect.

And we're going to start with lower amplitude because we have to precondition the body for this. The lower amplitude allows us to get repeat exposures. It's almost like if you had to blow up a balloon, you're going to stretch the balloon a little bit first. And so we're going to teach the connective tissues to store and release, store and release, store and release. Then what we do is we slowly expand the duration of that loading through the repeated jumps. We might use something like an oscillatory squat like we did with the Narrows. We can do that. This will eventually become something that might look like a jump squat. The point is we're only limited by our creativity under these circumstances. But the idea is to slowly increase the amplitude of these jumps. So we start with low hurdles. What we may end up with is something that is a much higher hurdle that we're trying to clear under those circumstances. If you've spent any time on the internet looking at jumping activities, you've probably come across Werner Gunther's old videos. He was a shot putter and does some amazing plyometric activities, which they're just fun to watch, but it's just a representation of what is possible. It's not something we would start with. We need to, again, precondition these people towards these activities. Eventually what we can do is maybe we can restore some of that yielding action and improve the vertical jump. So for all of you folks out there that were interested in the wide ISA vertical jump strategies, I hope this was helpful. If not, then just feel free to ask me a question at askbillhartman at gmail.com, askbillhartman at gmail.com. And I will see you guys tomorrow morning at the Coffee and Coaches Conference Call, 6 a.m. Thursday. Good morning. Happy Thursday. I have neuro coffee in hand and It is perfect.

Expansion posteriorly, expansion anteriorly, and we're manipulating the pressure through the hand. So we're getting pronation, supination, ER/IR through the shoulder at the same time. So check out that video. We want to move down then to the low oblique position where we can actually get the elbow flexed in this position because we're not pulling; we're reducing the demands on pronator teres. So now it can just be its true 'dead guy' self, where it's becoming the pronator of the forearm, which is what we want to restore normal proximal pronation at the elbow and start to reduce some of this orientation. Eventually what you can do then is start to build these orientations into some direct arm work if that's what you'd like to do. And then I would also suggest that we move from activities where both hands are on a fixed bar to activities where we have a free moving hand and we're doing one side at a time in regards to your pulling activities because what this is going to allow is going to allow the normal rotations to occur, so we're not getting symmetrical force production at the same time, which creates this anterior-posterior compression, which got you here in the first place.

Okay.

So I write one training program for all my field athletes, but I can bias it directly for each individual athlete. So they benefit from this. So the reverse band is going to help me elevate the guts because that's my greatest challenge. Now if I go to a wide circumference in the thorax and a narrow circumference of the pelvis, now my gradient bias is upward. So this is gonna reduce my ground contact time, so it's gonna increase my upward velocity. So these are the people that tend to stand out as athletes because what this does is it does give me better top speed. I have a lesser acceleration, but because my top speed is so good, I tend to make up for the lack of acceleration. So these people look good under almost every circumstance. They don't have as great a change of direction like our person with the wider relative circumference of the pelvis. But once again, it's like they just make up for it with top speed. If I want to apply this in the gym and I'm writing my program and everybody's doing a box squat that day, I'm going to have this guy just do a regular good old box squat. The basic premise here is you've got somebody that has a configuration that makes them an outstanding athlete. By most people's perspective, just don't screw them up. So now let's take a look at somebody that is a wide circumference of the thorax and a wide circumference of the pelvis. Now in this situation, I have a relative similarity between the upper and lower part of the axial skeleton. So I don't have a gradient bias where I would see the velocity changes internally that I would see with the other two configurations. So what this means is that I got a guy that can probably produce a heck of a lot of force, but it takes him time to do so. So again, this guy is going to be a guy that is really good at moving other people around. He can produce a lot of force. He doesn't get moved around a lot in and of himself. But because he needs more time to produce the force, he's not the fastest guy on the field. He might be still a great athlete, but again, he's not going to have the greatest vertical jump. He's not going to have great top speed. He's not going to have great acceleration. But again, he's a great positional person. Under these circumstances, what I want to do is I want to teach this guy to throw his guts up as much as he possibly can. So if I take this guy into the gym, what I'm gonna do with this box squat under these circumstances is I'm gonna do a bandit squat because what I wanna do is I wanna teach him to create the rebound of the guts off that the pelvic outlet as much as possible to create as much force as I can in the shortest possible amount of time. And so hopefully that gives you an idea of how this structural stuff actually does influence the level of performance. And all we have to do is understand how these influences affect top speed, acceleration, changes of direction, and we can tweak programs to individualize it for their physical structure.

But before I do that, go to the ITNY video on YouTube. Make sure you watch that. And then we're going to look at a clip on feeling dorsal rostral expansion. So you understand what that actually feels like. And I'm going to show you two of my favorite exercises for expanding the dorsal rostral area. One is a seated version, which is great for people that have wide infrastructural angles, concentrically oriented pelvic outlets. And then the standing version, which is the better band pull apart video, which I just love that exercise for a lot of people. So hopefully that is helpful for you guys today. Have a great Wednesday. And then we will see you tomorrow morning on the Eat Coffee and Coaches Conference call. So I got a question from Ryan and Ryan says, I'm wondering what dorsal rostral expansion should feel like. I think I know how to do it and I believe I can see it during certain exercises, although I'm not sure how it should feel. Any explanation would be helpful. Ryan this is a really good question because I think that it's a lot easier for us to visualize this on someone else than it is to feel it ourselves. So let's go through a couple of potential strategies that might be helpful. So Ryan one of the simplest things that you can do is actually just anchor the upper extremity and then try to create the dorsal rostral expansion. So one of the easiest ways to do this is to keep us through this inhalation strategy in the early phases of flexion. So all I really need to do is turn towards my table and I'm going to anchor my hands on the table so I'm not leaning on them because that could potentially create a compressive strategy posteriorly but I do want to have have physical contact with the table. I'm also going to emphasize the pisiform side of the heel of my hand, so the pinky side of my hand, because that's going to help me promote posterior expansion of the dorsal rostral area. So as I anchor my hands on the table, that's my primary point of contact. I'm going to extend the arms, and I'm going to try to create as much space between my scapula is possible. Now, a lot of folks under these circumstances have a tendency to want to try to elevate the scaps. So the easiest cue that I get folks is go ahead and shrug up as hard as you can, but then unshrug and that's the position that I want you to push from. And so now all I want to do is create distance away from the table. So while I don't want to lean on the table, I'm going to push myself away from the table and that's going to create a stretching sensation between my scapula. Then if I take my inhalation from there, And I breathe in, I start to feel an increase in that stretching sensation. And that's your dorsal rostral area expanding. Ryan, I'd also refer you to the dorsal rostral expansion exercise in sitting that is already up on YouTube. Ryan, if you're still having trouble feeling dorsal rostral expansion, here's a little tweak that we can give to a similar position that we use with hands on the table. But what I want you to do is you're going to make fists. You're going to crisscross your fists and put the pinky side of your hands together. Drop it down between your knees. I'm going to turn sideways so you can see this. I'm going to gain myself a little bit of squeeze with my knees, nothing too strong. And then I'm going to try to move away from my hands. And again, making sure I have the unshrugged position and I'm going to pull away. And again, what you're going to feel is a little bit more dorsal rostral expansion under those circumstances by that stretch between the scapula. And then once again, I would hit a comfortable inhalation. So you can feel that area expand. I would avoid an aggressive inhalation as this might cause a compensatory breathing strategy where you would try to expand anterior livers versus posteriorly. So again, the general inhalation under those circumstances, fist crossed, arms long, and try to create that space between the scapula. See how that works for you, Ryan. If it doesn't, let me know and we'll figure something else out. So I got a question from Mike and Mike asked, what's the best strategy for one to achieve dorsal rostral expansion without creating a bunch of forward bending of the spine? So this is a really common problem because a lot of people can't differentiate between expanding that dorsal rostral area between the scapula and bending the spine forward. So I'm just going to show you a little activity that's very easy to execute. and it will give you a very true sensation of dorsal rosso expansion. You're going to need a little bit of a band tension and you're going to need a surface to rest your elbows on. That's what I'm going to do is I'm just going to support my elbows on the surface. I'm going to make sure that I'm not reaching above 60 degrees, but I want the elbows in front of the body. Now I'm going to imagine somebody pulling down on my back pockets a little bit and so that's going to bring me back towards the posterior or the back side of my sit bones or your tuberosities. And then what I'm going to do is I'm just going to use the surface to expand posteriorly between the shoulder blades and then push my hands apart. So I'm supineating and externally rotating without moving my elbows. So I'm trying to get my hands a little bit wider than my elbows. Now if I take a breath in here, I get pure dorsal rostral expansion. So that gives me the sensation. Now I can take that sensation and just carry it over to any other activity where I'm also trying to achieve that dorsal rostral expansion. So give that a try. If you're doing some kind of band pull apart activity, thinking that you can alleviate your shoulder pain with bench pressing, you might want to think again. The band pull apart actually compresses the space between the shoulder blades that steals the range of motion in your shoulder that might be causing the pain in the first place. Instead, try this. Take a short band around your wrist like so. Put your forearms against the wall, keep your elbows below shoulder level. Take a little baby squat, tuck your hips under, push back to expand the space between your shoulder blades, and then pull your hands apart. You're gonna feel a little bit of burn on the back of the shoulder, but you're also gonna get that expansion in the upper back that's gonna restore the shoulder range of motion that bench press is stealing. Good morning. Happy Thursday. I have neuro coffee in hand and It is perfect, as usual.

And that's basically how we're going to create this intrathoracic pressure. If I were to allow the scapula to move, what I would have is an expansion on the backside of the thorax. I would still be able to concentrically orient anteriorly, but the tension would be less because the intrathoracic pressure is much less. And so this is where your less qualified lifters tend to be. They can't produce the coordinative effect that is necessary to increase the intrathoracic pressure, so they don't recruit as many muscle fibers, they don't coordinate well, they don't create as much compression, and therefore less tension, so they're not as strong and they don't have as much hypertrophy. Over time, what they do is they learn to coordinate these things and they get better and better and better over time. If you think about how a bench press shirt works, this is exactly how it functions. A bench press shirt can't lift any weight; what it does is it magnifies the compressive strategy in the lifter. So the more weight that you put on the shirt, the more compression, the more tension there is in the shirt—it squeezes me tighter. If I can ramp up that intrathoracic pressure, my force production goes up because intramuscular pressure goes up, and that's how you produce force.

which is going to help start to reshape the thorax a little bit, get some of that anterior posterior expansion, and as you can move into a lower obliques type of an activity, which would be closer to what looks like a side plank variation, you'll start to get some pump handle activity from that. You can do supine cross-connect so they should be in a non-provocative position based on the upper extremity and then a sideline propulsive activity will also be helpful. Again, sidelines are a great way, especially for these wide people, to get some of that anterior posterior expansion because we're taking advantage of gravity. Once you can capture 90 degrees of shoulder reflection without pain, supine arm bars are now on the table. You can throw in a screwdriver on top of that to promote some internalized zone rotation and then you can eventually move to a prom propulsive activity, which is going to get you a ton of that posterior expansion and yielding strategy that your client is lacking. If you want to take you into the gym, we've got suitcase carries that are probably on the table right now. Eventually you can probably turn it into a rat carry so we can get some E.R. and I.R. out of that. Backward sled drags with two handles to promote the uniling strategy posteriorly so you get some expansion, you get some pump handle action. You're also going to get some hip mobility out of that as well. High rep tricep push downs with a band. Also it's going to keep you close to that transition between internal and external rotation and give you some of the yielding strategy posteriorly in that dorsal rostral space. Again, you're going to need that. So dumbbell curl variations. There's a bunch of videos on my YouTube channel for that that you can also use to help keep that dorsal rostral space expanded. The key element with any of the resistive activities that I've just mentioned is that you can breathe through it. The minute you have a breath holding strategy under any circumstance during these activities, you are promoting the limitation that you are trying to alleviate. So keep that in mind. So in a nutshell, what you guys, you guys, it's very, very compressed. They're using compensatory strategies during the activities in question. So in the bench press, maybe they're carrying them around, I don't know, but either way, when they're bench pressing, this is what they're using. So you have to reduce the compressive strategies and eliminate the interference through all of the activities that you're doing. So you might have to restructure some programming. Unilateral activities are going to be much more effective than bilateral symmetrical activities and take the barbell out of their hands.

We know full well and we can actually track these things that those movements are never the same, although they are similar. So we're playing with signal and noise here where we want to minimize the amount of noise when we're talking about high levels of performance. So we can have a reproducible outcome even though it might not be exact, but there's not one best way. What we want to have is as many ways as necessary so the brain and the body can come up with a solution for any movement that would be within a specific context. Neutral spine is immeasurable and unnecessary as a concept. So the neutral word is on the list of dirty words that we try not to use because we can't even tell if anybody would be there nor do we know if anything is optimal. So what we're looking for and let's just talk about the axial skeleton as a representation of this is what we want is not one ideal. What we want is an adaptable axial skeleton that allows us to effectively distribute and transmit the forces that we're exposed to within a specific context. That's what's going to give us the best shot at a favorable outcome but also health at the same time. So let's get rid of the whole neutral word and let's move on to something that is more associated with making sure that we have that adaptability. Any model of movement must be coherent with physics. This kind of seems a little obvious, but we have to appreciate the fact that we are part of this universe and so we must behave as such. So we have to follow the guidelines of physics. So again, when I talk about things like expansion and compression, that's a universal principle. It's like we can't deny that. All we have to do is then recognize is, well, how do we respect that principle? Then we can actually have a deeper understanding of how we move.

Okay? And so what this is, this is caused by a limitation in shoulder flexion below 90 degrees. So this is a posterior lower compression that steals the early phase of external rotation of arm elevation. Again, go to YouTube and check out my shoulder flexion video so you can actually see how to measure this thing. We're also going to end up with an anterior orientation of the thorax because for me to have that posterior lower compression, I got all the other stuff laid on top of it. So I got dorsal rostral. I got pump handle down. So again, I'm dealing with a lot of compressive strategy and the anterior orientation. So I've got an early loss of shoulder flexion, but because of the orientation, I'm going to hit that IR early and then I'm gonna run out of internal rotation very, very quickly. So again, I get this compressive strategy right at 90 degrees. So here's the solution. Number one, we want to eliminate interference. So we're going to avoid bilateral symmetrical exercises. So most of this stuff with a barbell in your hands is probably a bad idea. Anything that's considered a lat development exercise is probably a bad idea with an exception that I'm going to talk about in a minute. So that takes chin ups and stuff like that off the table. Next step, restore the dynamic ISA. I have to have an ISA that can move so I know that I can recapture breathing excursion. We're going to keep the activities in below, rather, 90 degrees of shoulder elevation. Because what we're going to try to do is we're going to try to capture that posterior lower expansion. But I don't want to provoke any symptoms in the process. And so again, everything's going to be below that shoulder level. The exception might be that we can use a variation of a deep squat pull down. This might not be the first exercise of choice, but it might be something that we can go to because there's a turn that's associated with this. So once we drive something with a reach below shoulder level or a supported activity below shoulder level, we may be able to access a higher level of flexion without any symptoms whatsoever, and especially in this deep squat where we're gonna get some of that posterior lower expansion in that position. And then we can superimpose a turn. So we're actually going to use the compensatory strategy that Mihail was talking about to our advantage. And we create that turn and we create a reciprocal expansion as we move one arm through the pull down at a time. And that's going to give us the expansion that we want. So there you go. So there's your solution. This is for the Hawkins Kennedy positive test.

Right.

No, no. I can describe it. No, it's a demo video about improving your bench press lockout.

I know. You see how simple this is? That's why I get on here. It's like I just answer the same question every day, right? Good morning. Happy Thursday. I have neuro coffee in hand and it is perfect.

I understand it's very foundational for evals and stuff for just movement.

Bill kind of building off of all this. If you were dealing with one of those bodybuilders that step on stage at like 260 pounds that has pretty gnarly sciatica from it, how does your thought process and handling that change? Because now this guy's going to keep training and keep trying to push the needle forward. What's, I guess, like a result of a similar positional thing, like that posterior chain, just pushing forward? And how would you go about managing that? Cause this guy's going to want to squat heavy. He's going to want to leg press heavy. He's going to want to do all this stuff. What would be your guiding light for that?

So eventually what we're going to do is we're going to be able to work towards an inverted position in many of these cases to reintroduce the higher reaching and to make sure we've got the ability to close the ISA. I really like a reciprocal alternate pull down activity and standing that hopefully you can see right here. This is a nice little activity to reintroduce some of the resisted stuff. It's very similar to the squat variation I talked about with the Hawkins Kennedy impingement problem, but this is a nice way to reintroduce that. We can also superimpose some cervical rotation on top of that, which will actually improve our ability to expand the upper dorsal rostrum area and finish off that flexion without the compressive strategy. Okay, impingement number three. So this is the classic painful art test. This would be traditional shoulder abduction at 90 degrees and plus or minus about 30 or so and this is dorsal rostral compression from start to finish. And so this is from about the spine of the scapula downward. And so number one, we want to avoid anything that's going to compress that dorsal rostral layer. So bilateral compressive exercises like rowing, bilateral eyes, tees and y's, bilateral face pulls off the table. Now you may be able to perform these unilaterally if you can maintain a yielding strategy on the non-concentric overcoming side. So as I pull towards me this way, that's going to be the concentric overcoming. I got to capture yielding strategy on this side. If you can do that, then you can do these activities unilaterally. But to do them bilaterally, it's a bad idea because all you're doing is compressing that area. OK? Now, we still have all of our posterior yielding exercises that we can do. So again, we've got some of those prone variations, but one of my favorite things to do in this situation is go to my Better Band Pull Apart video on YouTube or anything that couples the yielding strategy in the dorsal rostral area with shoulder extra rotation. What happens under these circumstances is you're actually turning the scapula into what would be, I believe, traditional internal rotation of the scapula which actually bands, that dorsal rostral space to even a greater degree. Love those exercises for this situation. So this would be your typical painful arc strategy. So there you go. You've got three impingements, three strategies, three solutions.

When we do inverted exercises, like hip elevated inversion exercises, or hanging exercises, my question is, if I'm trying to achieve posterior expansion, but I have my arms extended overhead—either inverted or hanging—I'm not sure if that might slightly close off the posterior thorax. I wasn't sure, like, if there's a better way or how that is working.

So if I have a pelvis that's kind of smushed front to back and gets a little bit wider, if I put pressure through the ilium, then I can start to reshape the pelvis and get some rounding back there, okay? And that's under certain circumstances. And again, especially with these women that have had multiple pregnancies, the ilium will open because of the downward pressure, it will open like a flower that's blooming, and until we can bring that shape back into a more circular representation, they're not gonna get good muscular control the way we want to. Another thing that you can do, and this is kind of off the beat path too, is the old school foam rolling, take your foam roller, and you have them lay on their side and you're just going to roll that ilium across the foam roller as such and that's going to start to promote some of this rounding and shape change as well. So this then becomes some of your sideline activities, some of your rolling activities. Progressing into like maybe an armbar series if you take them back into the gym, but you might have to do something a little bit more Rehab-ish to promote this this public shape change that you need We work in split stance inside line. That's also another great way to to start to reshape the pelvis. Once you recapture the hip IR, then you can move to things like half kneeling. You can start box squatting in one of my favorite ways to restore the pelvic outlet behaviors. And then your good old fashioned Camperini deadlift. Once you get that IR back, because that would be indicative of, like I said, of a more normal behavior of that pelvic outlet. Once you recapture all this stuff, this is going to be somebody that you're going to reeducate in their hinging activities to help maintain this strategy. And we want to try to optimize that. So keep monitoring your ERs and IRs to make sure that you're not creating the anterior orientation. So again, your loss of ER is going to be indicative of that. So Tom, I hope this is helpful.

Once we can capture consistently our hip measures then we can turn this into a rolling arm bar to the left and again all we're doing is reinforcing left yielding strategy, right propulsive strategies and again we're just feeding the position that we need to restore our normal movement options. Okay, so Austin, I hope that gives you a couple of ideas on how to approach this thing and you understand what you're looking at. If you don't and you have more questions, please send them to askbillhartman at gmail.com, askbillhartman at gmail.com. And tomorrow is Thursday. Guess what? Coffee and Coaches Conference Call is back. So I will see you guys at six a.m. tomorrow. Have a great day. Tomorrow's chips and salsa day too. All right, see ya.

I truly appreciate your participation because you actually fulfilled my prophecy, which was that I was going to get some blowback on that. So I knew it was going to happen because people will only take in certain bits of information. So even if they were fully informed, even if they read the entire explanation of what I was talking about, they saw it through a limited lens. And so then they reacted emotionally and they responded appropriately based on those circumstances. So that was awesome to see. So I do love dissenting opinions. They're valuable opinions because even though they're incredibly wrong and misinformed and emotionally based, they are useful to help us check our own work and so again I do value that. And so then I have to take my experiences into consideration too and so let's just say that you work with developing athletes, young developing athletes and then another guy works with high-level professionals and you're having a discussion. you're going to speak through those lenses and so you might actually have disagreements as to what is most valuable in developing an athlete, but you're only speaking from your experience and you're speaking from the information that you see valuable. But this is why we see these silly arguments on social media about certain things. So there was one on Twitter not too long ago where they were people talking about return to play aspects and what you had to measure and what was important. And so you had a group of physical therapists that do the return to play conditioning and then you had some strength conditioning coaches that do some of the end elements of that return to play. And they're speaking from their own experiences and so of course they're gonna have disagreements as to what needs to be measured and what needs to be valued. If you branded yourself a manual therapist, a manual physical therapist, you're going to see through that lens and so of course then your arguments are going to be based on that. I have cognitive biases just like everybody else does that prevent me from accepting information. I also seek information to confirm my biases because I am human. That is just one of our behaviors. But again, recognizing those facts helps me sort of get over that to some degree, but I always know that that's going to exist. And so that's why I am such a stickler about avoiding the singular viewpoint. So I challenge people to not fall into a singular system because it immediately becomes a limitation because everything that you do When you adopt that singular viewpoint is I will acquire a tool that supports that or I will acquire more information that supports that and you become more and more limited. It doesn't mean you can't be successful because there will be points of times where that viewpoint will be very useful. But then you've immediately limited yourself in your scope of application.

Okay. So what do you think so far?

Previously in a video, I heard you say that lateral loads delay propulsion. That makes sense to me from a forward-backward locomotion perspective, but it doesn't make sense to me from a cut perspective. Because in my eyes and mind, the contralateral load would push you further into the cut, and then the ipsilateral load would push you out of the cut. Can you go over the cut sequence or what's going on in a cut from an ipsolateral and contralateral load?

If you have any other questions, please let me know at askbillhartman@gmail.com and I will see you guys on the Coffee and Coaches conference call tomorrow morning. Good morning. Happy Thursday. I have neuro coffee in hand and it is perfect. Welcome to the Coffee and Coaches conference call. Everybody's going to present with a little bit different representation of how they take information in, how they process it, and then how it's demonstrated through our behaviors, right? And so some people don't have the same tools, right? I mean, all you gotta do, if you look at everybody's picture on the screen—do you have the gallery view up? Everybody's picture on the screen, okay? So here's what I want you to do. Grace, I want you to look at everybody's picture for a second, and I want you to tell me who the strongest person on this call is, like physically strong—the one who could pick the most weight off the ground. Grace: No idea. Bill Hartman: Take a look. Grace: Oh, maybe a little guess.

Well, step one is kind of figure out where you are, right? So in most cases, it'll be very difficult for somebody who is legitimately a wide interpersonal angle, so that very horizontal helical angles. It's very difficult to create what you would consider any kind of posterior orientation of the pelvis. The amount of bending that would be required would be very, very difficult. But a lot of times you'll see these wide people and they will just be flat as a pancake across the backside, especially in the pelvis. And so it's not the sway that you would typically see with the pelvis with the narrows because the orientation of the sacrum doesn't allow it. So I would have a nutated sacrum. And so to have what would look like the traditional sway back where you have the pelvis is swayed underneath and they're almost standing in hip extension, you'd have to have a counter-nutrient sacrum to acquire that kind of appearance. And so in most cases, they're pushed, like what I describe it as they're just pushed straight through between the two femurs. And so it becomes this really aggressive kind of an external rotation. So, if I'm starting wide like that, and then I compress that. And this is, you see how the sacrum moves as a unit here, Matt? Under these hard compressive circumstances with the Y, it does not orient as such. It literally just bends. So from here down, the sacrum bends underneath. And I have MRIs and functional MRIs that actually show this. Um, and it's pretty hardcore. Like you get like a 90 degree angle, you know bent through the sacrum. Um, so again, there's a lot of compression here. And so where, where we'd have a narrow, there would be counter-neutrated and they look like they kind of just sway under like, so these wide people kind of push straight through like that. Right. Okay. And so, um, they it's like how does a wide person get so externally rotated and this is how they just get so compressed posteriorly they get pushed forward and then um what happens if you get this this ER orientation all the way down to the ground and so these are the people that they're on the outside edge of their foot there they'll have an inverted um calcinius they'll have an inverted look to their calcinius they may be bowed you know and so um all you gotta do is look at it at a really really good powerlifter with a really really strong sumo deadlift and you'll see kind of the same orientation yeah she said she mentioned that he was he was pretty duck-footed like like feet thrown out and then like so i like i

How do we like teeter this boundary of what it means to desire competence and then how would we define success not go after perfection and yet not in the same space settle and leave things on the table that could be gathered?

Yeah.